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SCAF
Rochester, MN
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 12:18:41 PM
Do you know what else is unethical and frustrating Mrs. Shannon and Mrs. Lund? How about packing students in hallways to take a picture so you can make it seem like your school is overcrowded and jam a new school referendum down everyones throat year after year untill it passes!!!
1966
rochester, mn
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 12:35:06 PM
The referendums will go on and on in Byron. They are never satisfied- they only want more. It is getting really old!!!!!!!!!
1966
rochester, mn
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 12:36:45 PM
And when will Wendy Shannon be moving to Byron to help pay the taxes?
bench rid
er
byron, mn
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 12:43:45 PM
Well, maybe if our elected representatives would get things done and done sensibly, The school would get funded equitably with the other districts in the state and the board wouldn’t need to ask for more.
If you don’t like the referendum merry go round, call your legislators.
Paperboy
Rochester, MN
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 12:47:13 PM
Shannon, just suck it up. Make the budget cuts we all have had to.
I’ll be voting NO! on the third this year and every year.
I’m sick of the city and it’s school system trying to sucking me dry EVERY YEAR!
whybyron
Byron, mn
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 12:52:03 PM
As a resident of Byron I see the ads and fliers as a sign of the tax payers being fed up with the outrageous property taxes we pay! I think it is absurd for a small town to ask their residents to vote to increase taxes over and over and over. Enough is enough! I am sure any parent with kids in the Byron school system would rather have the educational needs of their children met, even if it meant not having a fancy new high school! It is ridiculous for a town the size of Byron to have a high school like that! Anyone who voted that in should be ashamed!!!! I am sorry the schools don’t have the necessary funding, but as a tax payer, I cannot see having my taxes raised yet again! Too bad the city of Bryon/school didn’t think ahead about this as a possible situation instead of asking the tax payers to pay for that new high school! I am glad someone with an opposing view is voicing their opinion to the referendum, too bad all the facts weren’t right. All any of us as tax payers can do is vote to make sure your voice is heard that way!
C_Douglas
Byron, mn
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 12:58:53 PM
I’ll wade in here as a Byron school board member.
I’ve been in the schools. What is pictured is what it is like between classes. I’ve been there.
This is not a new school referendum, you are mistaken there. The facilities so generously provided by the taxpayers are very adequate for immediate and future needs. With the completion of the new high school, and keeping the old middle school as a community education center, we’ve been able to free up space at the elementary school to meet space needs for a long time. And we have the CEC to fall back on as well. The high school and middle schools are both under capacity. By converting the old HS to a middle school, we bought decades more of life out of that building.
This referendum is to meet the operating costs of education. The Byron district is the 6th lowest per pupil funded district in the entire state. Yet, it achieves some of the highest NWEA and MCA II test scores. The ACT scores for last year are the highest they’ve ever been at Byron. That shows that the district is efficient in running the district, and puts what little money it does spend toward academics.
The referendums will not go on an on. The district has adjusted to eight years of reduced funding from the state. Adjusted for inflation, it is receiving and spending less than in 2001. Even while reducing spending, over the last eight years test scores have gradually increased, reaching the point they are now. Everything the district has been doing for the last eight years has been to raise achievement levels.
Had funding from the state for education even kept pace with inflation, we wouldn’t be coming to the voters now. But, it hasn’t. The district has adjusted for eight years, and we’ve reached the end of cutting, without starting to cut those things that have raised achievement. The board is only asking for enough to maintain what’s in place, not add any more. We feel that by being able to maintain what’s in place, we can continue to see academic improvement. Cut those things and we’ll start to backslide.
The board pondered the amount to ask and the length of the referendum for quite some time, and wanted to make sure we only asked for as much as will be needed, and not to ask for too long a time period. We understand where everyone is with today’s economy.
Regarding the former board member’s propaganda, nearly every number, fact, and figure is either grossly inflated or made up in order to intentionally mislead voters. As pointed out in the article, a good question for people to ask him is why did he approve (and he DID) budgets that according to his incorrect source would have resulted in deficit spending of $3 million per year? His numbers are wrong, and the school hasn’t been deficit spending. He knows that.
And finally, 1966, Wendy Shannon DOES live within the district, and DOES pay school taxes.
If you’re interested in debating things based on FACTS, I’m more than happy to talk to anyone. If you’re interested in hiding your identity and slinging mud, to me that shows that you’ve no cogent argument to make.
Chris Douglas
Byron school board member
irishman
Rochester, Mn
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 1:09:19 PM
C_Douglas writes:...“Byron district is the 6th lowest per pupil funded...achieves some of the highest NWEA and MCA II test scores...ACT scores for last year are the highest they’ve ever been...Adjusted for inflation, it is receiving and spending less than in 2001. Even while reducing spending, over the last eight years test scores have gradually increased, reaching”...
Mr Douglas, you make an excellent case for cutting the budget even more to raise the scores to lead the state. Obviously the answer to a better education is not money, something else must be in play. Possibly the teachers themselves, maybe all else is wasted money????
whybyron
Byron, mn
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 1:23:58 PM
Mr. Douglas your comments are appreciated, however, I am sure you are well aware that the school district asking for more tax money in this tough ecocomy and with the recent tax increases in the last few years for the high school and the new city hall that the tax payers of Byron are tapped out. It is unforunate the funds aren’t there and the tax payers are asked to pick up the burden. It’s great that Bryon has above average tests scores, but I know as a Bryon tax payer, getting asked for my hard earned money again is enough! I am sure anyone can understand why the residents are asking when is it going to stop? Because I can tell you, evey year I have lived in Bryon the tax payers have been asked for more and more money!
bench rid
er
byron, mn
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 1:28:07 PM
Thanks for the clarification Mr. Douglas.
Irish...money is not the only factor in a great education, it also includes teachers, facilities, and excellent curriculum. And there does come a point where money, or the lack thereof will have a detrimental affect on those other factors. The Byron district is approaching that point, according to the school board. The money flow has been streamlined to the point where the next thing to suffer will be the education of the kids. They don’t want to make any more painful cuts unless they have to due to money constraints.
Stop and think about this, there are only 5 school districts in Minnesota that receive less money per pupil from the state...and there are almost 500 school districts in Minnesota.
BillChris
topher
Olmsted County, MN
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 1:36:14 PM
Since this affects my taxes and my kids I’ll chime in.
This should happen. No, I am not thrilled, but until the state begins to grant freedom in how a school can raise money for operating expenses this is about the only way.
Byron school gets it and the community has been very supportive which is probably why open enrollment into Byron is strong - not surprisingly with quite a few kids from Rochester.
My taxes will go up more than most and I would’ve liked to see other options in closing the gap, but I’d much rather have this done at the local level than being so dependent on the state and feds who give and take away as they see convenient.
BTW, according to my 2009 property tax statement, I am still spending more on Olmsted County than any Byron School levies.
irishman
Rochester, Mn
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 1:38:03 PM
benchrider: Agree, agree, good points, not always about the money.
Rochester #535 could look to Byron as an example of the importance of people over the dollars.
Should make a comparison however, correct me if I am wrong but Byron does not have thousands of kids who do not speak English brought in by your local charities do you? You also probably have well motovated parental involvement similar to a “private” school.
red13
Byron, MN
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 1:47:20 PM
First, Wendy Shannon has lived in Byron for several years and pays the local taxes.
Second, the district is simply asking the voters to decide if continuing to provide a quality educational experience for the students is a priority. We all make decisions every day on how we will spend our money. For many residents the cost of the new referendum is no more on a monthly basis than the cost of a lunch out or a couple of movies rentals.
Study the facts, not fictitious leaflets, set your priorities, and vote accordingly.
bench rid
er
byron, mn
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 2:18:04 PM
irish...without knowing exact enrollment numbers, I can still say that, no, Byron does not have thousands of non-English speaking students. And I would also agree that there is a very strong parent involvement in the district. Suffice it to say that I am very satisfied with the education my kids received in Byron, I know the administration has done an excellent job with the resources it has been given by the district.
C_Douglas
Byron, mn
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 2:57:12 PM
whybyron: Believe me; we know how tough it is to be asking voters for money in this economy. I have two friends that live in Byron that have lost their jobs in the last three months. The board has been debating this and looking at options since January. It was not an easy decision to come to, but I can assure you, we’ve done our homework. I can’t tell you when it’s going to stop. Unfortunately, the school district is only one part of your taxes. You should also know that cities, county, the state can raise your taxes as much as they want, and they don’t have to ask. When a school district wants to spend a nickel over their budget, they have to ask the voters. That’s why the polls will be open in Byron next Tuesday.
Irishman: You’re right, money isn’t the answer, but it is part of the answer. Byron has achieved its results due to a few things. It has honed the budget to make sure every penny that can be is spent on academics. Wendy Shannon brought, and the staff has done a phenomenal job of implementing continuous process improvement. Every department carefully tracks test scores and results, along with the curriculum to achieve those results. If something works, they do more of it. If something doesn’t get the desired results, it’s modified or scrapped. In the five years I’ve been on the board, we’ve had countless updates from different segments of the staff showing their results. Programs have been expanded, others dropped. It’s an all out focus, by everyone from board to administration to staff, on RESULTS.
And let me say something about our teaching staff. I know there are dedicated teachers everywhere (they must love education, they sure don’t go into it for the money!), and I’ve very little experience with staffs in other districts, but I can say I am so proud to have the staff we do in Byron. They’re truly dedicated to what’s best for our students. How dedicated? I’ve been on the district/teacher contract negotiations committee the last two times we’ve had to look at the contract. Our staff came in this year and one of their biggest concerns was what was best for the students, given the economic situation. We agreed together on a “soft” salary freeze for teachers for the next two years. What is that? There was a little money given to the teachers to be placed on steps and lanes, which is where they can see a slight increase for years of experience or gaining more education. However, a majority of our staff will not be eligible for that in the next two years. Our staff approved a contract in which most of them will be getting NO RAISES for the next two years. They also gave back their staff development dollars, which are set aside for them in the budget for their continuing education. That’s a dedicated staff!
And finally, to Irishman, you are correct, we don’t have in Byron a high percentage of free and reduced lunch, ESL, or other students. That’s part of why our funding is so low. It is what it is, we’ve accepted that, and we’ve dealt with it.
I do appreciate the economic times we’re in. We have cut and cut and cut ($500,000 out of this year’s budget), but we’ve reached the point where academics WILL backslide should the levy not pass. All we are asking for is to maintain what’s in place that is achieving these results. I can assure you, we’re not asking for a penny more. We’ve shown with results that this district spends its money very, very wisely. I can assure you that at least this board member (and the others) will make sure this continues. The Byron taxpayers have demanded it, and we take that very seriously.
Should anyone want to contact me, any of the other board members, or Dr. Shannon for more information, our numbers and email addresses are on the district web site.
AverageJo
e
Anywhere, US
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 3:10:23 PM
The legislature is playing chicken with taxpayers. If taxpayers continue to approve referendums, state mandates will continue to choke public schools.
Unfortunately, it will take school district implosions across the state to persuade the legislature to reinvent public education that can thrive in the economy and while FOCUSING on children that succeed in the new world.
Regardless how your district is operating, vote NO to all referendums. Tell the legislature to reinvent, consolidate, and unshackle school districts from surrogate parenting mandates.
bwoodhous
e
Byron, MN
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 3:54:53 PM
I have proudly been a teacher in the Byron School District for the past ten years. My husband and I moved to Byron six years ago so that our children would go through the Byron schools. As a teacher in the district, I can tell you that we have felt the recent $500,000 in cuts that the school board had to make for this school year alone, in our classrooms. As a parent, I feel very fortunate that my children have the programs that they need to succeed, and I want to see those programs continue. I will be voting yes on November 3rd not only as a teacher, but as a parent and community member who sees that the children in our schools today, as cliché as it may sound, truly are the future of our community, and they deserve an excellent education.
len9807
mantorville, mn
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 3:58:01 PM
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 12:52:03 PM
As a resident of Byron I see the ads and fliers as a sign of the tax payers being fed up with the outrageous property taxes we pay! I think it is absurd for a small town to ask their residents to vote to increase taxes over and over and over. Enough is enough! I am sure any parent with kids in the Byron school system would rather have the educational needs of their children met, even if it meant not having a fancy new high school! It is ridiculous for a town the size of Byron to have a high school like that! Anyone who voted that in should be ashamed!!!! I am sorry the schools don’t have the necessary funding, but as a tax payer, I cannot see having my taxes raised yet again! Too bad the city of Bryon/school didn’t think ahead about this as a possible situation instead of asking the tax payers to pay for that new high school! I am glad someone with an opposing view is voicing their opinion to the referendum, too bad all the facts weren’t right. All any of us as tax payers can do is vote to make sure your voice is heard that way!
--
I agree with your comments, but my real issue is with the new government center. I understand preparing for growth, but to go from 240 sq feet to 24,000??? Now it sits largly vacant and very expensive.
len9807
mantorville, mn
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 4:00:45 PM
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 1:36:14 PM
Since this affects my taxes and my kids I’ll chime in.
This should happen. No, I am not thrilled, but until the state begins to grant freedom in how a school can raise money for operating expenses this is about the only way.
Byron school gets it and the community has been very supportive which is probably why open enrollment into Byron is strong - not surprisingly with quite a few kids from Rochester.
My taxes will go up more than most and I would’ve liked to see other options in closing the gap, but I’d much rather have this done at the local level than being so dependent on the state and feds who give and take away as they see convenient.
BTW, according to my 2009 property tax statement, I am still spending more on Olmsted County than any Byron School levies.
--
If I understand the open enrollment correctly, the state money follows the child. The more enrollment, the more state money.
VA172
Southeast, MN
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 4:05:45 PM
Here is the cold hard fact. Good school districts need the money to remain on top.
Here is another fact. Public organizations, no matter who or what will always ask for more tax dollars.
BillChris
topher
Olmsted County, MN
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 4:13:17 PM
“If I understand the open enrollment correctly, the state money follows the child. The more enrollment, the more state money.”
This is correct. I am just pointing out that Byron is getting an inflow (and not hemorrhaging) of new students from surrounding areas because of their achievements.
Personally, I think its more appropriate for Byron residents and businesses to fund (and decide how much to fund) Byron schools and not St. Cloud, Duluth or Minneapolis schools through the redistribution of money at the state level through a formula.
Other options for raising funds were brought up, but state law prohibits them.
BillChris
topher
Olmsted County, MN
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 4:17:32 PM
I have heard that it costs over $60K/year to house one inmate in Stillwater State Prison. Area schools avg $3500 - $11000 per student.
Seems wrong. One number could stand to be a bit higher and the other much, much lower.
TheHaikus
ter
Rochester, MN
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 4:18:46 PM
Who sent the mailer
To Byron homes, for more tax
did not sign their name?
Yellow sheet, spread lies?
Teachers union? Was it them?
Perhaps the school board?
Postman doesn’t know
Postmaster knows not either
Perhaps Chris Douglas?
Mailing was unsigned
Teachers should be embarrassed
Resorting to this.
Find out, Chris Douglas!
Tell us here, who sent mailer
Spreading talking points.
Byron homeowners
pay taxes that scare away
Business and others
Taxes are too high
Make cuts, and live within means
Our pockets empty.
heart093
Byron, MN
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 4:24:12 PM
Sounds like Phil Fuchs is sticking up for what HE believes is right. Sounds like SOME school board members are more worried about what Mr. Fuchs is bringing to the attention of us tax payers, ONCE AGAIN. No one is the bad person here, including Mr. Fuchs, which school board members and Dr Shannon are triing to bully. Thank you Mr. Fuchs for sticking up for us tax payers. We too have had to make adjustments with our life style,do to the economy, it’s about time they must too. Our family will be voting NO!!
bwoodhous
e
Byron, MN
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 4:41:57 PM
TheHaikuster: The yellow mailer was made and sent out by the Vote Yes Committee. It was an oversight, not deception and all further information has been labeled paid for by the Vote Yes Committee. All of the information is accurate and can be backed up by reputable sources.
westofroc
h
Rochester, Mn
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 5:56:48 PM
To follow up on your comment bwoodhouse: Not only is the information the Vote Yes Committee current and correct, as it should be, it is in direct opposition to the lies posted by Phil Fuchs. Hey Phil, why, if you’re opposed to the levy, do you have to spread lies instead of just putting out fliers saying, “Vote No” and why vote no? When you have to lie to get your message across, then your message looses it’s edge.
newtobyro
n
Byron, MN
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 6:22:16 PM
Sounds to me that Mr. Fuchs has had ample opportunity to get the facts, but refuses to. If he was truly concerned about the Byron Schools, one would think he would want the facts, not site some web site that sells generic clothing.
I guess I understand his losing school board campaign signs now… he is a both fake and fiction.
Please get out and vote on nov 3… a NO vote is OK as long as it is based on facts. What Mr. Fuchs is distributing is a fake as he is.
ElGuapo
GoingGalt, MN
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 6:36:58 PM
Sounds to me like the cadre of incompetant school board members who don’t want to DO THEIR JOB and the teachers unions should be the ones worrying about legal problems.
Anonymous propaganda?
Tell me more about this previously anonymous VOTE YES Committee. Who is on this committee? It is all well and good that you give yourself a name, but tell us about who is on this committee?
Any school board members? Teachers union members?
This levy is just another example of incompetence by the Byron school board. They don’t want to do the tough job of balancing a budget, so they play to the guilt of the taxpayers to assuage their inability. “Byron schools are great!““Let’s keep them great!“
If money makes a school great, why isn’t the Minneapolis school district the tops in the state?
MAKE THE NECESSARY CUTS! The Byron taxpayer already is paying through the nose for your state-of-the-art, we-spared-no-expense high school. The tax burden is already outrageous.
DO YOUR JOB.
Tripp
Rochester, MN
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 6:51:11 PM
For what it is worth I checked out the website: http://www.boardingschoolreview.com/
I’ve asked them some questions but it is too soon to expect a reply. I will say the website is odd - the website presents detailed information about schools but there is only a small note stating where the data comes from - “Note: Data has been gathered from several government and commercial data sources. School data reflects 2006 statistics (most recent year available).” I have not found any disclaimer or description of how accurate the data is.
I have also found no procedure for addressing errant data.
The closest thing to a disclaimer that I could find was a statement in their FAQ -
“If you have a question for a particular school, please contact that school through their phone number located in their profile on our site.”
I’m not sure what the motive is for the people putting up this website.
ElGuapo
GoingGalt, MN
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 7:24:20 PM
Don’t think for a second this is the last time that the levy issue will manifest itself.
The next time that the teachers union says it wants a raise, watch the school board dance like a monkey to an organ grinder.
Here’s an idea. Ask the teachers union to offer up a bone when it comes time for their next collective bargaining agreement. Demand that the taxpayer get some accountability. Demand that the teachers union forgo tenure. Time to get rid of the burned out and incompetent teachers.
Especially the teachers who spend their time in class on their laptops and filing their fabulous manicured nails.
Kane
WhereaboutsUnknown, US
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 7:51:31 PM
Setting aside another embarrassing Fuchs controversy for a minute or two let me start by saying this: Mr. Douglas and the other school board members are quite competent. To say more is displaying one’s utter lack of familiarity to the situation.
The numbers aren’t lying. Cuts are being made, salaries are being frozen and I have to wonder if the opposition would feel the same way if they were attending school and this levy made the difference to them being able to participate in their favorite sport or artistic activity.
I normally fall on the opposite side of the tax argument and for good reason. We waste a considerable amount of money at the federal and state levels. There is a considerable amount of money spent on social programs because of the shortfalls of many schools to adequately educate students to excel - not exist - out in the real world.
Should we start pushing 25-30 kids into elementary classes keeping in mind the special needs kids also in attendance. I also have family members volunteering in the schools. It gives a far greater appreciation to the gravity of the situation.
I know there really couldn’t be a worse time to push for another levy. That is the failure of our state and federal governments tying their revenue stream to income taxes. As revenue gained by taxing personal income and capital gains plummets, the needs to maintain the government programs remains a constant. That’s why piling government programs on top of government programs is so short sighted. When times are tough there is outrage and the folks at the local levels bear the brunt of the angst.
Cutting at the local school level instead of at federal levels is penny wise and pound foolish.
...and yes this will make my taxes go up to, but I anticipated it can stomach the increase. Similar to an earlier poster, I am also paying (if the levy o/r would pass) over $500 more in county taxes than school levies.
overtaxed
byron, mn
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 7:54:04 PM
im not sure if parnets pay fees for sports or extra activities they should like other places maybe pay more then....also maybe everyone in the school district should take a pay cut cut like i have and i m sure others, watch my home owners ins go up. and my homes value go down.....its time for state , county and goverment employees to all take a pay cute andin there benifits or pay more, like the rest of us for them ....
i say vote no make the parents whos kids are in school pay more and the school district take pay cuts or pay more for there benifits to make up the short fall or make more cuts to the budget....and the comments we pay more to olmsted county well that is a dumb comparison county has alot more expsenses roads ,garabge law enforcement etc tired of this town as a whole wasting tax payers money from city hall to sommersby poorly designed industrial park..... the point of living in a small town is low taxes not as much or higher then rochester that has way more to offer in resturants , stores entertainment etc byron offer very little except high taxes, outrages waterbills ....
PurpleFan
Rochester, mn
mldenney
Byron, MN
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 8:15:22 PM
ElGuapo,
Exactly what is your purpose for joining in on this discussion? Obviously you know little about this district. It appears you have nothing positive to say about the board, teachers, or administrators who have made Byron a top-notch school district. And it appears you have no real valid suggestions for the issue at hand. Please go away.
This is a simple matter of the state not funding the district properly, and we need to make it up with this referendum. It’s not that much if you look at the your individual increase, and I think some of the opposition is making a mountain out of a molehill.
Kane
WhereaboutsUnknown, US
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 8:16:09 PM
On the contrary...as a rural resident, I get much more bang for the buck from locally approved levies than from county levies. I get snow plowing and law enforcement. My point is that, yep my property taxes are high, but what I pay to the school is well under half.
I still have to noodle out how we raise a few hundred thousand dollars from student activity fees.
Maybe George Soros can send his grand kids to Byron.
farmboy
Rochester, MN
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 8:25:44 PM
Comment Removed.
Editor's Note:
Please refrain from name-calling.
C_Douglas
Byron, mn
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 8:30:14 PM
Heart: Phil isn’t sticking up for you, he’s lying to you.
ElGuapo: You’re obviously choosing to ignore facts in order to take out larger issues you have with teacher’s unions and government in general.
The school board has done its job, and has continued to cut expenses ($500,000 this year alone). Adjusted for inflation, the district is spending LESS per pupil than it did in 2001. Should the referendum fail, we’ll do our job and continue to cut. Unfortunately, all the academic gains made since the last levy will backslide. We’ve reached that point.
At the last negotiations (I’m one of three representing the board in these), the teachers agreed to a contract where the majority of them will get no raises in the next two years. The teachers also gave back the money that is set aside for staff training and development. So, they have “offered up” several “bones” already as far as helping the district meet its budgetary needs. It’s this same staff that has taught the kids in Byron well enough that they have some of the highest test scores in the state.
The vote yes committee is chaired by Faith Hollasch, a school board member, and Brooke Woodhouse, a teacher for the severely developmentally disabled in Byron. They are also taxpayers in Byron, and have kids attending in the district. Because of that, they have just as much right as anyone else to support the levy. I have donated money to the committee. Of course, you’ll infer something sinister by this.
The vote yes committee uses information supplied by the Minnesota department of education, the district’s audited financial reports, and discussions that have actually taken place at the school board about what will or won’t happen depending on the vote outcome. ALL of the information they’re sending to voters can be confirmed by going the department of education website, the school district website, or stopping into the district offices where it will be provided for you.
Mr. Fuchs chooses to either make up information, or use inaccurate data from publicschoolreview.com. The district has tried for over three weeks to contact the owner of the website, to no response. So Tripp, don’t hold your breath. A little digging about this website has found that the address listed for the site owner is a parking ramp in Manhattan. It uses as one of its sources Wikipedia, which our students aren’t allowed to use as a source on academic papers as it’s been proven so unreliable. As stated on one part of the website, one of their primary businesses is selling school district mailing lists. They also sell knock off athletic clothing.
Overtaxed: Fees are paid for extracurricular activities. We raised the rates this year, and even if it passes, will probably do so again next year. We’re also looking at fees for some activities that don’t currently have them. As another part of the negotiations with the teachers, they agreed to move to an insurance plan that saved the district thousands upon thousands of dollars. So they’ve given up on their benefits some as well. I’m sorry your water bill is so high. The school district really can’t do anything about that, though.
All the school board is asking is that if someone opposes the levy, and if they’re going to disseminate “facts” about it, they follow state law and not LIE about it.
ElGuapo: It’s easy to lob bombshells, make sinister inferences, accuse Wendy Shannon, me, the Byron teaching staff, and the rest of the board of incompetence from behind an anonymous screen name. Just know you only make yourself look foolish in doing so. Be an adult and at least be willing to stand honestly by what you write.
Somehow, I think you’ll take the coward’s route. Fire away, tough guy.
Chris Douglas
ElGuapo
GoingGalt, MN
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 8:37:41 PM
mldenney:
I have idea. How about you WAKE UP.
Byron didn’t need a new high school and all the associated infrastructure. It needed a new middle school. But the school board decided it wanted a show-piece Taj Mahal to go along with their wonderful new golf course. So a new senior high school it was. The SE Minnesota version of Edina, coming right up!
Cha-CHING!
Byron cannot attract business, because the taxes are so high. (nice industrial park, BTW) Byrons homeowners complain that their taxes are outrageous, and are told that is because there isn’t enough business to tax the baJeezus out of.
So after suffering through these various tax schemes, corrupt city administrators, and pie-in-the-sky development projects, you think the Byron taxpayer should be more forthcoming?
While other towns of your size have one school, you have 3 separate ones. How’d that happen?
How about this, Mr. Denney. Why don’t you and your true believers put your money where you mouth is and fund this scheme yourself?
I am a private business person. My costs are relatively fixed. Except for labor. I can’t run to the taxpayer and say, “I can’t balance my books! My labor costs are killing my bottom line! Save me from my incompetence!”
I suggest you and your ilk take it to the teachers union that it is time for them to offer up a lil something for the effort. The fact that Byron teachers are given everything they want when collective bargaining comes around speaks volumes to the fact that the school board CANNOT SAY NO.
Gotta keep the peace, ya know. Can’t have unhappy teachers unions.
jared
kasson, mn
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 9:13:04 PM
Well stated Mr. Douglas. Thank you for putting Mr. Guapo in his place.
I support your efforts to prepare future generations the best we can.
Bolts
Byron, MN
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 9:30:41 PM
I thank Phil Fuchs for stepping up an getting some information out to those not in favor of the tax increase. Although some of the info may not be accurate, there is some accurate info in his letter. Does anyone remember the first referendum for the new school? How do I now trust that the school board isn’t going for well more than what is really needed. It seems that going from $126 to $504 is extreme. Why not just go to $300.
We currently have 288 students that open enroll to Byron. Now I’m asked to pay more as a Byron resident to support non residents who bring there kids to school here. That doesn’t seem right either.
I want kids to have a great education, but I think this FIRST referendum deserves a no.
Glideman8
8
Byron, Mn
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 9:36:09 PM
This Boarad is demanding a 400% increase in taxes!!!
I’ll keep voting NO until a realistic request is made!
Shadow
Rochester, MN
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 9:37:43 PM
Call me crazy, but thanking someone for putting out false information? Really? If someone willingly and purposefully disseminates false information, how can anything they say be trusted?
2old2kid
byron, mn
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 10:05:23 PM
Personally I think Phil’s motivation is to educate voters to the fact that there is a minority of people that want “the best” for their children while they are living in Byron, (meaning Byron is one stop on their career train) when they move on they leave the “locals” holding the bag and footing the bill.
2old2kid
byron, mn
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 10:15:31 PM
Quote:
We currently have 288 students that open enroll to Byron. Now I’m asked to pay more as a Byron resident to support non residents who bring there kids to school here. That doesn’t seem right either.
Bolts:
I here ‘ya...I’d like to know how many students are open enrolled elsewhere that should be enrolled in Byron schools. I doubt its even close to being a wash!
Bolts
Byron, MN
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 10:20:49 PM
Shadow:
The following information is a Fact: The school boards first try for a new high school asked for a 49M referendum. The one that passed was 26M. Have you been to the new high school? It is fabulous. Now ask yourself why they asked for 23M MORE the first try?
Tripp
Rochester, MN
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 10:25:13 PM
As Shadow says, when one presents falsehoods to support one’s case it discredits the entire case.
It seems to me Bryon is facing the same problem nearly every town in America is facing - fuel costs are rising and the business tax base is shrinking. The towns try to court corporations but they are competing with about every other town in America. This is the way corporate CEOs want it - they enrich themselves by pitting towns against each other, impoverishing workers and impoverishing the towns.
And Elguapo, you blame unions and taxes for everything. The large corporations love this - it keeps you fighting with your neighbors and it takes the pressure off the corporate CEOs.
I’ll tell you what I was told when I was laid off by a major corporation - there was nothing I could do about it and I needed to change myself to make myself more attractive to today’s corporations.
I’m sure they would tell you the same thing - your business model is flawed and instead of blaming the wrong people and blaming the wrong things you need to change and find a better business model.
Does this suck? Yes, it does. Iy sucks for me and it sucks for you. Clearly the corporate executives have the power and they expect the workers and the small businessman to pay the costs and to do the changing.
You need to see the world the way it is and not the way corporations and Limbaugh want you to see it. Otherwise you will continue to rail against the wrong people and you will simply isolate yourself by being unpleasant and you will never find a solution to your problem.
ElGuapo
GoingGalt, MN
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 10:26:31 PM
“Should the referendum fail, we’ll do our job and continue to cut. Unfortunately, all the academic gains made since the last levy will backslide. We’ve reached that point.” Chris Douglas
Oh, that is RICH!
If the Byron School Board was doing its job, it wouldn’t be coming to the Byron taxpayer with hat in hand asking for another financial rescue.
And this: More money = academic achievement. Using that bit of insight, tell us all why the Minneapolis school district is so stellar?
FACT: The reason the Byron ISD does so well, is that it doesn’t have the associated problems of Rochester or the larger cities. It also does not have a large migrant population of some smaller towns.
Like your test scores? Lets add a few Rochester gang-bangers into the mix. Maybe a few dozen dysfunctional “open enrollees” from out on Marion Road coming out your way?
To put it more precisely, there are a higher percentage of parents how CARE in Byron than there is in Rochester.
Your teachers and students have 3 relatively new schools. Look at Stewartville. Look at Pine Island. You think YOU have it bad?
If your labor costs are killing your bottom line, it is time to tell your employees to take a hike. Unless you haven’t noticed, there is a bit of an economic downturn. And there are a lot of recently graduated, unemployed teachers out there looking for jobs.
Why don’t you try getting tough with the teachers union for a change? Get rid of tenure, and give the taxpayers reason to say YES.
farmboy
Rochester, MN
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 10:37:57 PM
Comment Removed.
Editor's Note:
Please keep comments civil.
mldenney
Byron, MN
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 10:44:07 PM
ElGuapo,
No idea where you’re coming from. You seem very bitter. Take care.
Ah...just googled ‘Going Galt’ That explains a lot.
Well, I proudly support this referendum, and do donate extra time and money to ensure my kids (and others kids) are well-educated.
mldenney
Byron, MN
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 10:56:52 PM
Bolts,
Actually, the open-enrolled kids bring a lot of money with them(from the State) and Byron comes out ahead there (more come in than go out). So we get kids and their money to help dilute our fixed costs, essentially. That reduces how much the district is asking you for in this referendum.
There’s plenty of Referendum information out there if you need more details on this.
ElGuapo
GoingGalt, MN
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 10:59:23 PM
Well Mr. Denney, thanks for voting for money out of other peoples pockets to assuage your guilt. Correlation does not imply causation. Look that up while you are at it. More money does not mean higher scores. The Byron School Board is incompetent and should be doing its job.
And I think I’ll stick around, thanks.
farmboy: I don’t hate teachers. I despise unions.
“When school children start paying union dues, that’s when I’ll start representing the interests of school children.“—Albert Shanker, longtime American Federation of Teachers presidentSo, excuse me if I am a bit incredulous when someone from the teachers union or their civic minded lapdogs say, “We need to do this for the children!”
C_Douglas
Byron, mn
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 11:16:53 PM
Poor ElGuapo. I see he once again insults my competence, but still doesn’t have the maturity to openly stand by what he writes while doing it. I refer to those types of people as cowards:
From Dictionary.com:
Noun-
A person who lacks courage in facing danger, difficulty, opposition, pain, etc.; a timid or easily intimidated person.
Bolts, a little education about open enrollment in Byron schools. First, open enrollment is a state law, and if a district has capacity at a grade level, they HAVE to take the student. Talk to your state legislator about that. Secondly, we’ve already closed several grades to open enrollment that have reached set capacities. We reject any students wanting to open enroll in those grades.
The state funded money for those open enrolled students comes with them to Byron. They formula is complicated (A high-school student is worth more than one student, a kindergartener less. I know, I know. Don’t ask me. Talk to that legislator again!). However, on average we get about $5500 per open enroll student coming in. That’s $1,243,000 for the district that comes with them from their home district. Those students need teachers. The number needed is about 7.5 at a district average of $50,000 (salary and benefits). Subtract out that, and leftover is and additional $868,000 per year for the district. Money for books, reading intervention programs, college credit courses, etc. that wouldn’t be available for students were the open enrollees not there. There is a balance, though, the board agrees. The board has set a limit of no more than 15% of the students will be open enrolled. We’re at about 13% right now. This is an item we monitor at every board meeting. You should try coming to a meeting sometime and see what actually goes on. The next one is Tuesday, November 10 at 7 pm. Hope to see you there.
You actually thank Phil for lying to you. Unfortunately, not even the numbers he provided for the first building referendum were correct. The first referendum contained three questions (for $43.8 million, not the $49 million as claimed by Phil). The second referendum, one question. Comparing just the first question from the first referendum with the second referendum, the actual numbers would have been $35 million as compared to $27.6 million. However, even that first one included considerable upgrade work at the elementary and middle schools that was left out of the second. High school to high school (apples to apples), you were looking at about $33 million as compared to $27.6 million. About a 17% drop, not the 47% as he claims.
Another tidbit for you: The state provides debt equalization aid for smaller districts when they pass referendums, depending on the dollar amount. This is in place so that larger districts help smaller districts with facilities. Building this high school in a city of 300,000, like Minneapolis, is much easier on each taxpayer’s pocketbook than a city of 4500 like Byron. Basically, the state would have paid 40% of Byron’s mortgage for the life of the first referendum, now they pay less than 20%. What does all this mean? Yes, the second referendum was for less than the first. However, the individual taxpayer’s contribution, due to the change is equalization aid, is the SAME. That’s right; you’re paying the same for what was built, as you would have for a new high school along with considerable work at the two other schools.
It’s all good though. What we have is working. I’m completely satisfied. I helped chair the committee that came up with the first, defeated, referendum. It’s just too bad we’re all paying the same for $27.6 million as we would have for $35 million. Had we each actually paid less for less; that would have been even better.
2old2kid: I don’t know where you come up with your supposition. By lying to you and the rest of Byron’s taxpayers about the school district’s finances and the upcoming levy (every fact and figure he’s provided so far is wrong), Mr. Fuchs is telling people that a minority of residents actually controls all of them? How does this correlate?
Get out and make an educated vote November 3rd!
Chris Douglas
ElGuapo
GoingGalt, MN
Posted on 10/28/2009 at 11:43:18 PM
Chris, if you and your fellow travelers were competent, you wouldn’t be asking the Byron taxpayers to save your bacon.
Welcome to Economics 101.
EOM
auhmee
Rochester, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 1:07:50 AM
Phil Fuchs is just plain dumb. All he does is cause issues in Byron time after time. I went to Byron High and there was not enough room. Some teachers did not even have their own rooms, they had their supplies on wheeled carts and would need to “borrow” a teachers room who did not have students during that hour; a new school was needed. I am sick of people complaining about taxes, if you hate it move, don’t build huge homes you can’t afford in the first place...education is important and even if you don’t have kids in school you are paying for the future.
levelhead
ed
Byron, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 7:45:36 AM
I’ve attended school Byron school board meetings. I have been in the Byron schools during the school day. I have formed my opinions on the competence of the board members and their decision making ability. I have gathered the facts and dismissed the lies. I have weighed this things against the increase in property taxes I would pay if the referendum passes.
I will be voting yes on Nov 3rd.
edved
Minneapolis, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 9:02:04 AM
I think either way, Phil Fuchs is getting what he wants. He gets to read his name in the paper. Personally, I would have a hard time reading anything from a GROWN MAN who inserts himself into a hazing issue like he did in the past.
Im not a Byron taxpayer so I have no real opinion on the referendum, but it sounds like the facts are made available to those interested. I would encourage people to get educated and not gather their information from the irrelevant T-shirt guy.
Bolts
Byron, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 9:15:50 AM
$126 to $504. How can anyone look at these numbers and not feel like the school board is asking for a bit much. After this referendum fails, the school board will come back next year and ask for a number lower than that and it will more than likely have a better shot at passing. They also can not deny they asked for an “over the top” high school the first go round. I don’t think the lesson was learned.
thegalls
Mantorville, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 10:28:03 AM
Instead of trying to resolve a complaint about information via the court system, why not just publish your own flier and clear the air?
Wouldn’t that be a great deal more productive then creating a big media circus that just clouds the message that you want to put out?
Tripp
Rochester, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 10:29:59 AM
Comment Removed.
Editor's Note:
Please keep comments civil.
Tripp
Rochester, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 10:44:24 AM
Comment Removed.
Editor's Note:
Please keep comments civil.
Bolts
Byron, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 10:46:18 AM
After reading Chris’s comments that we are paying the same for the current school as we would of if the first refererendum passed. Are you saying the current school is NOT a scaled down version of the first pass? If we would of went for the scaled down version FIRST, we would be paying less in taxes. Would we not?
1966
rochester, mn
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 10:48:13 AM
Can someone tell me what it costs Byron tax payers to have all of these kids coming from Rochester and Pine Island to Byron to school? Pine Island keeps voting NO and so the parents are sending their kids to Byron to school. Then MOVE to the Byron school district. Why should the Byron taxpayers pay for kids coming from schools that the parents don’t want them to attend? Is this what the open enrollment is all about? Does Byron get reimbursed for this?
ProAmeric
an
Byron, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 10:50:57 AM
I think that it is time for the city and the schools of Byron to see reality and act on it. Continuously coming to the taxpayer for more money is not an appropriate solution!
The city of Byron has drastically overbuilt its infrastructure to support a city of a much larger size. The anticipated super growth just did not happen and may take decades to happen or may just never materialize in our lifetime.
A few things that could be done that may help reduce expenses would be to sell the middle school that is no longer used as a school, lease out the new city hall and relocate it back to the old city hall or share the fire station as the city hall, increase class sizes to stay within budget, reduce school administration (one example: combine high school principal & superintendent of schools), etc., o o o etc..
Tough times call for tough decisions! Our families must make cuts in these tough times and so should our leaders of Byron.
shhhhh
Byron, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 10:52:01 AM
Facts:
Mr Fuchs was apart of three of the last four contracts negotiated by board/teachers. Those of you who think the teachers got all they wanted ask him why.
Teachers salaries in the district have not kept up with inflation over the last 6 years. Not many peoples have and you to not hear a lot of us complaining about it.
Phil was a board member who had a high absent rate from board meetings, yet still collected his stipend.
Mr. Fuchs has the right to post his beliefs, thoughts and opinions… please stop with the false information!
ProAmeric
an
Byron, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 11:01:23 AM
I think that it is time for the city and the schools of Byron to see reality and act on it. Continuously coming to the taxpayer for more money is not an appropriate solution!
The city of Byron has drastically overbuilt its infrastructure to support a city of a much larger size. The anticipated super growth just did not happen and may take decades to happen or may just never materialize in our lifetime.
A few things that could be done that may help reduce expenses would be to sell the middle school that is no longer used as a school, lease out the new city hall and relocate it back to the old city hall or share the fire station as the city hall, increase class sizes to stay within budget, reduce school administration (one example: combine high school principal & superintendent of schools), etc., o o o etc..
Tough times call for tough decisions! Our families must make cuts in these tough times and so should our leaders of Byron.
Trainman
around, mn
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 11:15:28 AM
The reason for the tax increast wouldn’t have anything to do making more space for open enrollment students would it? I know of anothe district that tried pulling that deal and it didn’t work. Keep your district for it’s kid and the tax money for your own too.
westofroc
h
Rochester, Mn
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 11:18:52 AM
1966 I think you need to read the previous posts by Chris Douglas. The Byron School District benefits over a million dollars from it’s open enrolled students. Something on the order of $5500 or more per student from their home districts.
Trainman
around, mn
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 11:25:41 AM
1966 - NO those people from out side the district don’t contribut a dime. The should have to move to the disctrict for pay a fee like private school kids do.
anonymous
Rochester, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 11:30:40 AM
train, bad analogy. DE has over twice the number of oe students, and is turning them away as we speak. de taxes will soon be rising (they have the lowest levies in MN thanks to oe) because you can’t make any more $ of oe now that you’re full. your de school as it exists are already not a “district for it’s kid.” If it was, you’d be only 65% of your current size. No new additions, and shrinking like all the other schools.
your scared little minds will soon make your wallets littler too!
BillChris
topher
Olmsted County, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 11:30:56 AM
It was mentioned before, but yes, Byron gets reimbursed for open enrollment.
I’ve given this a lot of thought and here it is: You can’t run a public school like a business or a family. A business can raise or lower prices on products it sells. A school doesn’t have that kind of flexibility. A family has a lot more control of the majority of its obligations than a school does. A school receives most of its mandates from the federal or state level and is handcuffed by union contracts.
So who pays most when cuts are made? The students who don’t get to vote - except for the small minority that are 18.
There is a lot of consternation about the high school. For me its water under the bridge. I didn’t get to vote on it, but I moved here knowing it was an obligation. How buildings are appropriated and used for education is a fair debate, but probably for another day.
(I guess this might be why churches doubled as schools in some older communities - surely it would never come to pass now.)
BillChris
topher
Olmsted County, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 11:36:26 AM
Here is a link to a really long argument about when OE began:
http://www.prospect.org/cs/articles?article=choice_ironies_open_enrollment_in_minnesota
Second paragraph:
Minnesota recently became the first state to adopt an open enrollment policy allowing parents to send their children to public schools outside their own district. Under the program, state aid that would have gone to a student’s home district goes instead to the district where the student attends school.
This syncs with what the Byron school board says now and agrees with every other article I have ever read on OE. I would think a lot of people would be in favor of school choice.
Trainman
around, mn
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 11:41:29 AM
DE has the lowest levees because of a responsible school board who spends the money wisely and an intelligent super. I know full well what goes on at DE. We may need to have a tax raise, but it will NOT be to add on to the buildings for more of other school districts kids. I’m on a fixed income and pay more than my fair share because I am a land owner.
Eleanor
Byron, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 12:07:24 PM
Here’s the way I think of it: For our family, the increase in property taxes from the referendum would amount to the price of one family dinner out at a restaurant per month. Can we give that up for our children’s education? Yes.
Paperboy
Rochester, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 12:35:48 PM
I’m still voting NO! If others think this referendum smells like a teacher’s spin doctor tale, aka dead skunk on a hot day, get out and vote NO!
If they had their way our schools would look like the White House with a teacher/ student ratio of 1:1. Let’s bury this referendum in front of the Byron tombstone, with new landscaping, I should add, that’s located outside the city on Hwy.14.
Another bonehead idea.
TripleH
JimThorpe, PA
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 12:58:48 PM
I think Mr. Fuchs had a massive heart attack after his last bout with the board. Mr. Douglas may be headed for the same? Is it worth it? Maybe sending Mr. Fuchs two steaming hot Cherry Pies (his favorite) will calm him down. Maybe Mr. Douglas could don the tights and wrestle Barron Von Raschke for a fundraiser?
AverageJo
e
Anywhere, US
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 1:15:18 PM
PB: You’ve published every conceivable document clearly pimped out by the School Board, but we still haven’t seen the flier.
As it is the document in question, how about giving us a look-see?
The other
side
Eyota, mn
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 1:16:20 PM
I didn’t want to stick my nose in a topic that does not pertain to me but since DE was mentioned I will give some info for both sides to think about.
DE did vote “no” on a referendum to increase capacity to accomodate oe so we may have potentially made the mistake of “over-building”. That said, the Board only presented and the community responded, the way it should be.
We also had our “Fuchs” and as it appears, our “Tripps”. They will get their point out at all cost and not have the ability to weigh both sides. I think everyone else here has shown pretty reasonable judgement on their decisions.
DE was also a victim of the economy and you can’t blame someone for voting “no” if the family budget just can’t handle it. I felt students were worth the sacrifice but could certainly understand.
One thing I did question though was the increase only affected DE households and not the oe households. I believe this to be true and did not agree with that. It should affect all households of students the same. DE does profit from oe though.
I feel like I am talking out of both sides of my mouth but those are things we had to think about. Byron is different in that you have already built it and now you need them to come.
I wish you the best of luck and no matter what happens just try and support the decision and it will work out. You have an excellent district and should be proud of it. We thought very seriously about Byron when deciding where to put our children.
C_Douglas
Byron, mn
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 2:12:57 PM
TripleH: Dear GOD! The thought of what I’d look like back in a wrestling singlet made me throw up a in my mouth a little bit. I’d never subject anyone to that! And I’m willing to admit I was never very good at it 25 years, ago. I’d be pathetic now!
All: I’ve made my points here. My only wish has to been to answer questions and correct inaccuracies when posted. I’ve been willing to put my name and thoughts out in public, and not hide behind a screen name. My email address and phone number are posted on the school district web site. I welcome anyone willing to discuss this issue, or any others related to public education (or youth wrestling, my first love).
It has saddened me to see how quickly this conversation devolved. It saddens me that seemingly adult people will hide behind screen names to lob accusations and names at other people. It saddens me that people aren’t adult enough to openly debate an issue, clearly identifying who they are. It saddens me that very late last evening someone (hiding behind a screen name, of course) posted here a threat of physical violence against me. Thank you PB for removing this.
Again, feel free to contact me. Anyone who knows me knows I LOVE good conversation. Anonymous letters, emails, and phone calls will be ignored. I’ll be at the volleyball game tonight. Feel free to introduce yourself and help cheer on the Byron girls.
I’ll accept and respect the opinions of anyone voting, no matter which way they opt. My only hope is that no matter their view, they’ve made the decision based on fact. As a school board, we are doing our job. Sometimes that job means making the painful decision to ask the voters for more.
Now, it’s up to the voters. This is their decision. The board will deal with the consequences no matter what happens. We’re prepared either way.
Just know, this is NOT the school board’s decision, it’s your’s.
Get out and vote November 3rd!
Chris Douglas
Trainman
around, mn
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 2:17:10 PM
Very well stated “Theotherside”.
One thing I did question though was the increase only affected DE households and not the oe households. I believe this to be true and did not agree with that. It should affect all households of students the same. DE does profit from oe though.
I whole heartdly agree with that also.
ElGuapo
GoingGalt, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 2:55:16 PM
Comment Removed.
Editor's Note:
Please keep comments civil. Please refrain from profanity. Please return to topic.
levelhead
ed
Byron, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 3:07:23 PM
Comment Removed.
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ElGuapo
GoingGalt, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 3:26:50 PM
Comment Removed.
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edved
Minneapolis, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 3:28:30 PM
Comment Removed.
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ElGuapo
GoingGalt, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 3:32:57 PM
Comment Removed.
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edved
Minneapolis, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 3:37:08 PM
Comment Removed.
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anonymous
Rochester, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 3:48:36 PM
theother and train, I do hope you see though, that if de doesn’t keep increasing it’s oe numbers, you taxes will have to go up significantly. your sup. and board (yes responsible board) knew that, sad you didn’t.
anyway, you have a great district you should be proud of, and your 440 oe kids (more than come from Dover) make it even better.
and train, you first stated that oe parents “don’t contribute a dime.” any chance you want to retract that, as it’s been shown repeatedly that’s not true? didn’t think so.
schmidtem
ployee
Byron, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 4:22:53 PM
Comment Removed.
Editor's Note:
Please keep comments civil. Please return to topic.
schmidtem
ployee
Byron, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 4:28:01 PM
i don’t know Chris Doulgas and i haven’t lived in byron very long but if he ever runs for mayor he will have my vote.
well, gotta go back to work now. have 30 minutes left, unlike el guapaotdao...get a job man.
Signed,
Jack Sparrow
Paperboy
Rochester, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 4:54:27 PM
Where can I send money to cover Phil’s legal defense?
schmittts
Rochester, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 5:05:23 PM
Even though I have no horse in this race, I’ll toss out a couple of thoughts.
I don’t like operating levies. They almost always stem from a larger budget problem and seem like putting a Band-Aid on a decapitation victim. Bonding referendums and capital levies are a different breast and deserve to be evaluated on a case-by-case basis.
Second, the first levy always seem to include the whole wish list. Usually, if the first one gets voted down, the board goes back, takes out the unnecessary stuff, and then comes back with a more reasonable levy. Someone mentioned the Byron High School levy above. I’ve seen it happen with RST school levies too. It’s like haggling on the price of a new car, don’t take the first number the salesman tells you.
heart093
Byron, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 5:17:30 PM
I agree with paperboy...where do we send money for Phil’s legal expenses? Did anyone find out who exactly is on the “Vote Yes Committee”?
lifer
Byron, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 5:51:46 PM
I was going to vote ‘no’ but than decided to vote ‘yes’....just to spite Phil.
mldenney
Byron, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 6:18:12 PM
Heart093,
This blog is pretty long, so perhaps you missed the post that had the following info:
“The vote yes committee is chaired by Faith Hollasch, a school board member, and Brooke Woodhouse, a teacher for the severely developmentally disabled in Byron. They are also taxpayers in Byron, and have kids attending in the district. Because of that, they have just as much right as anyone else to support the levy. I have donated money to the committee. Of course, you’ll infer something sinister by this.
The vote yes committee uses information supplied by the Minnesota department of education, the district’s audited financial reports, and discussions that have actually taken place at the school board about what will or won’t happen depending on the vote outcome. ALL of the information they’re sending to voters can be confirmed by going the department of education website, the school district website, or stopping into the district offices where it will be provided for you.”
The other
side
Eyota, mn
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 7:32:48 PM
Anonymous
“theother and train, I do hope you see though, that if de doesn’t keep increasing it’s oe numbers, you taxes will have to go up significantly. your sup. and board (yes responsible board) knew that, sad you didn’t.”
Please tell me how you came to the conclusion that I don’t know my taxes could go up. You must have quite an ability if you could draw that conclusion. I recall saying that I felt the increase is worth it when it comes to kids and education.
Tripp
Rochester, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 9:03:21 PM
People are free to pay money to defend Mr Fuchs, but if I am to believe the quote in the paper tonight, he knows that the numbers he is quoting are incorrect, and he knows that citing these numbers is against the law, but he plans on continuing to cite them anyway. His defense, again from the article tonight, is that he is only the middleman and *somebody* must have come up with these inaccurate numbers.
He says that even though the user agreement of the website in question states that the site authors make no claim to the validity of their numbers, and the user, Mr. Fuchs in this case, is responsible for contacting the local state department of education for the correct numbers.
I know that some people believe what they want to believe despite the facts, and some people view disputes like this more like a sporting activity where one must support one’s team no matter what, but I still am astonished when I find people openly voicing support for alleged criminal activity.
It makes me doubt their reasoning and judgment, and if anything it discredits them.
If I was against the referendum the last thing I would want is people lying to try to ‘support’ my views.
This referendum is not my business. I’m just amazed at how low and dishonest and obnoxious some people are. Frankly I am glad I do not have to deal with such people in public life.
kiddos
Byron, MN
Posted on 10/29/2009 at 10:11:41 PM
Regardless of how the school district got to this point, the bottom line is, it affects the children. The community can either support the children of Byron or turn their backs on them. We as adults could spend less on material items we think we need and save that extra dollar for the children of Byron. It’s the children that are going to pay the price and they don’t have a say in it.
anonymous
Rochester, MN
Posted on 10/30/2009 at 7:30:57 AM
theother, sorry to have lumped you in with train. you seem to be quite level headed, have a good day.
whybyron
Byron, mn
Posted on 10/30/2009 at 12:55:06 PM
I think what some people are forgetting here is that Byron has notoriously over taxed it’s residents for years and as a result, many are going to vote no on this. We know it is for the kids, we know how important an education is but can the district come up with a lower cost to the tax payers? Can’t there be a middle ground so that the kids get what they need and the tax payers don’t continue to feel like they are being taxed to death? I understand the needs but my vote will still be no on November 3rd and will continue to be no until a more reasonable referendum is put out there for the tax payers to consider.
overtaxed
byron, mn
Posted on 10/30/2009 at 2:22:58 PM
????? MR DOUGLAS problem with schools one superiedent usally makes well over 100,000. they have asstiant superiendents,MAKKING OVER 55000.00 assistants,,,and secrataries a prinpale and they have staff to ????....etc way to much staff and over paided in my opion...for example one large hgh school athelcti director made 80,000 and had three full time staff when i was in high school a teach er was the athletic director and didnt have a bunch of staff......so honestly how many people in the school district do we have on staff under the superident and princaple that we really dont need assistants etc just like state and county goverment add jobs . that arnt needed to get there friends jobs and over pay them ... so BOOTTOM LINE MR DOUGLAS HOW MANY PEOPLE ARE UNDER THE SUPERINTEND DOWN TO THE PRINAPLE AND THERE STAFF BESIDES BEIENG OVERPAID ANYTHING OVER 50,000 .00 IN MY OPIONION IS JUST WRONG EXSPECIALLY OVER 100,000 IS CRAZY...AND RIP OFF OF TAXPAYERS WHAT DOES DR. SHANNON MAKE AND HER STAFF MEMBERS (HOW MANY ARE UNDER HER DIRECTLY) LET ALONE PRINPLES HOW MANY ARE THERE OR ASSISTANTS THEY HAVE OR SECRATARIES IN THE DISTRICT.....SHED SOME LIGHT
anonymous
Rochester, MN
Posted on 10/30/2009 at 3:49:39 PM
overtaxed: Did you ever actually attend school? what do you have against the English language? Not only do you not realize caps are swearing, but it’s physically painful to read your grammar.
Really, can you write like that and seriously represent a side on this? Are you actually a referendum supporter trying to make it obvious why we need better schools?
sombat
Rochester, MN
Posted on 10/30/2009 at 10:41:02 PM
I didn’t quite get through all the comments, but the people in Byron should be really happy they are not living through the headache of Rochester schools these days. On another subject, what I always wonder is why does the US spend more on public and private education than 24 other industrialized countries and yet consistently we show poor results educations in comparison to other countries that spend less. Guess that shows that it’s not necessarily money that gets results.
mldenney
Byron, MN
Posted on 10/31/2009 at 8:39:52 AM
Sombat,
Interesting statistic. Any idea how they measure that(the poor results, not the cost)? I would think it would be very difficult to compare, but I could be wrong (been there before).
Baldwin
Rochester, mn
Posted on 10/31/2009 at 11:00:22 AM
Yup lets keep fighting each other for some crumbs meanwhile the U.S government gave away 30 million dollars to Israel yesterday. We gave another 30 million dollars away today too, and we will give another 30 million away tomorrow. You see we give away 30 million dollars EVERYDAY to Israel in foreign aid. But it is not only Israel that gets huge amounts of our money many countries do, but Israel gets the most. How many schools can we fund with one days worth of that money?
So keep fighting over the crumbs folks, you and your Democratic and Republican parties deserve it.
mldenney
Byron, MN
Posted on 10/31/2009 at 11:33:14 AM
Baldwin,
According to your profile, you’re usually right, you have great ideas, you’re smart, and talented. Super! You can help solve the money-to-Israel problem.
Simple folks like myself will try to solve the day-to-day school funding issues with the resources we have available to us today.
sombat
Rochester, MN
Posted on 10/31/2009 at 1:12:30 PM
You can find a whole slug of data regarding spending and outcomes. Here are just a couple:
http://thebluesite.com/ustopseducationspend.htm
http://blog.heritage.org/2009/02/10/lessons-for-congress-about-education-spending/
Baldwin
Rochester, mn
Posted on 10/31/2009 at 3:03:30 PM
mldenney, keep arguing shuffle-board points, while the Titanic is sinking.
mldenney
Byron, MN
Posted on 10/31/2009 at 3:14:42 PM
Sombat,
Thanks for the links. And I think for the most part this agrees with what the District is saying: education is expensive in part because of unfunded mandates and extra-curricular opportunities not offered in other countries.
The good news is this is 2003 data showing the average US cost is $10,000 per student, and here we are in 2009 still spending much less than that in Byron. Obviously we don’t have many of the challenges that bigger districts have, but we still have the mandates, and a surprisingly high number of students that qualify for extra attention due to those mandates (approx 10% qualify for some level of special education, for example).
Also, our school board whole-heartedly agrees that more and more money does not translate into better students, but there is a point where not enough money hurts the students, and that for sure is a gray area that is constantly changing.
C_Douglas
Byron, mn
Posted on 11/1/2009 at 1:21:37 AM
I will start by apologizing for the lack of brevity.
I read with interest the story in today’s PB comparing several local school levy requests. It’s interesting that the story notes in the communities other than Byron there are no reports of groups organized against the referendums and in the ZM district, it’s reported that there’s “an enormous amount of positive support”.
Some analysis of the levies in that story (all numbers in ascending order):
Current 2009-2010 Per Pupil Funding including in-place levies
Byron $6291
BP $6761
ZM $7176
RP $7507
MN Avg. $8219
Austin $8276
Current levy
Byron $126
Austin $304
BP $350
ZM $700
MN Avg. $821
RP $840
Note: These above are the levies currently in place that the districts are looking to replace with their new requests.
Proposed increases via levy
RP $100
Austin $227
ZM $250
Byron $378
BP $550
Notes: All of the above requests are replacing existing levies with new ones, so the amount listed is the increase over what’s currently in place. Blooming Prairie is asking two questions and these numbers are putting those two together. Austin is replacing two smaller levies with one that is larger.
Tax Impact/Yr 100K home
RP $35
ZM $65
Byron $78
Avg. $81
Austin $84
BP $145
Note: Average is for the five mentioned districts
Tax Impact/Yr 150K home
RP $53
ZM $97
Byron $117
Avg. $122
Austin $126
BP $217
Note: Average is for the five mentioned districts
Levy after successful passage
Byron $504
Austin $531
MN Avg. $821
BP $900
RP $940
ZM $950
Per Pupil Funding w/ Levy passage
Byron $6669
BP $7311
ZM $7426
RP $7607
MN Avg. $8219
Austin $8503
Note: This number based on 2009-2010 funding levels. Levies would not go into effect until 2010-2011 school year, so actual numbers at that time may vary slightly depending on changes in the state funding formulas.
As I represent the Byron district, I’ll comment on their levy request.
Of the districts in the story, Byron currently has the lowest per pupil funding. It also has the lowest current levy. It has asked for the second highest increase. For tax impact on $100k and $150K homes, it’s right in the middle, and very slightly below average. Should all the mentioned levies pass, Byron would still have the lowest levy in place. Byron would still remain the lowest in per pupil funding.
All of these districts are asking their voters for operating levy increases and they all have their own, particular reasons. These are all very good school districts, and I am not making these comparisons to make them look bad in any way. I applaud the support they get from their voters. We’re blessed that in Minnesota, and especially in SE Minnesota, public education is generally very good compared to the rest of the US. Based on how much this was studied and agonized over by Byron’s school board, I know that the boards in these communities agonized very hard as well. It is NEVER easy to ask voters for a levy.
I know taxes in Byron are high. I pay them too. I’m well aware of all the goings on in the city, having grown up here, and other than college and a few years living in Lakeville, have been back in Byron with my family since 1999. The school board can only control school related things. It has nothing to do with anything going on other than school district things.
I’ve mentioned ad nauseum in various forums and letters the academic successes Byron schools have had in recent years.
All things considered, and based on the school districts in the article, why would one oppose a levy request that has a slightly BELOW AVERAGE property tax increase, to replace the LOWEST levy with one that will still be the LOWEST levy, to provide more funds for the LOWEST per pupil funded district that should the levy pass will still have the LOWEST per pupil funding of these districts?
Why are the voters of ZM willing to have $700 in levies now, and have “an enormous amount of positive support” for a $950 levy, when Byron’s is only $126?
I can surely understand a person’s own situation, and their ability to take any more. And I respect each and every voter’s decision.
I believe the voters of Byron are more than willing to support their school district as much as the voters of Austin, Blooming Prairie, Rushford-Peterson, and Zumbrota-Mazeppa. I believe the voters of Byron will take the challenge to stand up and say, like the voters in these other fine districts, that education is a top priority.
No matter the outcome, what happens is not the school board’s decision, it’s the voter’s.
Please get out and vote YES on November 3.
Chris Douglas
Byron School Board
Sources:
MN DOE
www.education.state.mn.us
Byron
www.bears.byron.k12.mn.us
BP
www.blossoms.k12.mn.us
ZM
www.zmschools.us
RP
www.r-pschools.com
Austin
www.austin.k12.mn.us
Rochester Post-Bulletin
(No web address needed, you’re already here!)
All of the numbers used are from the above sources. If any of these numbers or calculations is wrong, I apologize and take full responsibility. I will gladly make any corrections.
I apologize for the ALL CAPS words. I don’t know how to do that “bolding thingy”.
I also apologize that you can’t just click on the mentioned web addresses and go to those sites. I can’t figure that one out, either.
Yes, it is very sad that I’ve nothing better to do on a Saturday evening.
jtej9598
b-town, MN
Posted on 11/2/2009 at 3:07:09 PM
“I was going to vote ‘no’ but than decided to vote ‘yes’....just to spite Phil.” I LOVE IT! Thank you!
It’s amazing that all the naysayers get their comments removed because they can’t be civil and “stay on topic” ... says a lot doesn’t it?
Vote Yes on the 3rd .... Byron is a GREAT District and our town is counting on you! Go Bears!!!!
jtej9598
b-town, MN
Posted on 11/3/2009 at 10:04:01 PM
Congratulations, Mr. Fuchs & “friends” ... you won your personal vendetta on the backs of our future! Way to go!
lifer
Byron, MN
Posted on 11/4/2009 at 10:22:33 AM
Well said. So many of the naysayers I met were those whose children are done with school or just finishing. Shouldn’t our kids have the same great education/activities?
